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**** Item Removed & Harassment That Followed


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#1 Carez7

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Posted 27 November 2012 - 02:13 PM

Hello. Thank you for your time in reading and responding to this post. I will try to be brief. I am an **** seller and have been for some time. I recently had one of my listings removed from *** for a violation. Upon contacting **** the forwarded me the name of the person who complained and their contact information so that I could further discuss with them what the issue was with the item I had listed. I e-mailed this person, at a law firm apparently, and waited for a response. Some time later I got a fairly rude and somewhat generic response that my item violated DMCA codified at 17 USC 1201 and that I was upsetting their client by selling this item on ***and I should destroy it immediately and send them proof I have done so. After this I researched this law and what I am selling and it seems as if neither of these things go together. The item I am selling is simply a HDMI converter which is commonly sold all over the place and used to convert HD signal to non HD Tvs. My research also showed that this item can be altered and used in other ways, much like many other similar items, to copy digital media but this is not the intended used of the item nor is this how I described the item. In fact until these people informed me of this I did not even know you could use this item for that type of purpose, much like I am sure many other people do not know either. Its like saying selling a hammer that could be used as a weapon down the road, makes no sense. Anyway long story short I only have a couple of these items I was planning to sell and I am not some big competition for any other seller of this item, it is simply something that came in a larger group of items I purchased intentionally for resale online, and now I am being harassed by some law firm and my **** reputation is being tarnished by them reporting my items as violations. Is there any type of legal recourse I have in this situation? Each time I have e-mailed these people for answers they are getting more abrasive and rude and threatening, as if I have really done something in an attempt to violate all of these laws that do not even apply to this item. Any advice on this situation is greatly appreciated. Thank you.

Edited by FindLaw_AHK, 27 November 2012 - 02:45 PM.
This post has been edited to remove personal or identifying information. -Moderator


#2 adjusterjack

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Posted 27 November 2012 - 06:52 PM

Give me a break. You're making a mountain out of a molehill. Nothing's happening to your "reputation."

Do you have $5000 to $20000 to litigate this? And spend a year or two out of your life doing it.

You're always going to get some whiners on ****.

I swear, people on **** can be such infants.

I suggest you ignore these people and put the last few items on Craigslist and sell them locally.

Then get over it.

Warning: Legal issues are complicated. Explanations and comments here are simplified and might not fully explain the ramifications of your particular issue. I am not a lawyer. I do not give legal advice. I make comments based on my knowledge and experience. I guarantee nothing. If you act on my comments without the advice of an attorney, you do so at your own risk.


#3 pg1067

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 07:54 AM

now I am being harassed by some law firm


You consider the sending of a DMCA notice and responding to the e-mail you send to the law firm to be "harassment"? Seriously?


and my **** reputation is being tarnished by them reporting my items as violations.


"Items"? Plural? What other items were reported? Why didn't you mention them? Or are you only talking about the one item you mentioned.

In any event, the service of a DMCA notice cannot possibly tarnish your reputation? If the name that was edited out by the moderator is what I think it was (the largest online auction site), the company that runs that site couldn't care less about you. It simply received the notice and did what it needed to do to avoid potential liability for any infringement you might have committed. That doesn't mean you actually committed infringement or that the company made any determination that you did. It's far easier to take down a single auction than to deal with a potential lawsuit by a large intellectual property rights owner. It's not as though you now have a big asterisk next to your screen name branding you as a bad guy. Note that whether your auction actually is infringing or whether, if it is, you sold it innocently or maliciously are irrelevant facts.


I swear, people on **** can be such infants.


I don't disagree with this, although I don't think I'd go quite this far. My observation has been that persons who sell on the site regularly seem to develop a sense of entitlement, which is unreasonable because they are really no different than a person who rents space at a swap meet.

#4 pg1067

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 08:01 AM

Each time I have e-mailed these people for answers they are getting more abrasive and rude and threatening, as if I have really done something in an attempt to violate all of these laws that do not even apply to this item.


I forgot to respond to this point.

I find it a little curious that you think you are more qualified to assess whether the item is infringing than a lawyer who presumably has a regular practice in the field of intellectual property law. As I mentioned above, whether your item actually is infringing is irrelevant to the particular issue you raised. However, your subjective evaluation of a legal issue that has been hotly litigated for over 30 years is not particularly credible. As I also mentioned, in terms of infringement, the issue is not whether you sold the item "in an attempt to violate" someone's intellectual property rights. The issue would be whether it actually does violate Section 1201 -- regardless of whether you knew it did.

I don't know how much the item in question cost you or how much you were attempting to sell it for, but I doubt it's worth any legal battle.

#5 RfrmPepl4Btr4Chldrn

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Posted 30 November 2012 - 11:28 AM

You know what Carez7, the responses to ur concerns are a window into the world we are setting for our kids & the every reason why "tough guys" like the big bad attorney guy is picking on u! Because when u out cried for help in defending urself, no one offered assistance, but instead judged u for ur desire for justice!

Sadly, folks have either given up hope with how things are or are just too consumed in there own life to care. I bet the guys below, would def... Fight back If it were done to them or even engage in road rage if some1 decided the were more entitled to be in front.

I'm not blaming these guys below, honestly, y'all probably don't even think about ur actions...bc we are all in survivor mode. However, it took me a huge circumstance to see where my head was at & where it should be.

We're all in this together & I do hope any1 even " Mr. Attorney", doesn't have to experience a wake up call like I did. We need to try to bring back the old family values & forget about being the better manager, bc we gave up our family time.

Anyway, I applaud u for wanting to stick up for urself, regardless who feels ur worth it.

Here's how I might proceed, if they never bought from u, I would submit a request back to the site moderator, requesting that the slander be removed as they don't have experience with ur sales abilities, and they have no fact that u r promoting what the items can potentially do.

In the meantime, I would post a rebutle, claiming the same and that ur awaiting formal removal of his comments. Just claim, he's just one of those angry people who is only brave enuff to validate himself by bullying someone while hiding behind his keyboard. If he was a real tough guy (or smarter for that reason), he'd pursue the corporation for making such capable equipment.

I might add a note for ur interested buyers to view ur actual buyers ratings, which is fact and not accusal.

I also might add that ur post was not ill intended, but rather protective of ur rights to sell items that have a real use other than what he claiming, & that u agree with his efforts to stop the issue, but as long as their produced, they'll be used as the owners wish, his cause won't ever be successful unless he stops production. So his energy on bashing u just showed the readers of his projection of his anger for his failures to someone vulnerable rather than fighting the cause.

Oh & keep everything, if he is a true sociopath & only goes after the little guy buy continuously bashing ur reputation or harassing u, don't engage back, beat him at his own game...sociopaths are mostly all mouth, they need the excitement & knowing they're bothering u, just claim he's twisted & a coward for jumping at u, & then get him 1st, u can now file criminal assault charges against Cyber bullying, cyber Stalking, & I believe slander, but that might be civil. Keep everything, use screenprints so he can't claim u modified anything.

Good Luck, God Bless.

Hey u guys below, wanna be a real hero, turn off ur electronics & make a difference...du something other than judge people for things that u wuld du urself! If u say u wouldn't, then ur lying to urself, because we all do it...I've cured my attacks on others, most of the time, but can't beat the full moon! Bc I never look in advance, & only catch myself after the fact!

I do make right by apologizing, if they do fight back, I add in a, "Awesome, glad u pushing back on principle! Oh u must be the few chosen too, to doing God's work, great going, see u in heaven". We all have a small window left, it's between u & God! I hear its not pretty in the realm of Hell, folks claim that ur banded for eternity to live out all ur torments here, over and over and over and over, without peace, for until the next world. I can't say for sure, never been myself, but def don't want to find out.

Peace!

Oh, PS - please have a bit more sense than to have faith in anyone's abilities & knowledge, purely based on title. Most booksmart folks, weren't given the streetsmarts, unless, they're ambidextrous or a repeat lifer here.



#6 pg1067

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Posted 03 December 2012 - 03:52 PM

when u out cried for help in defending urself, no one offered assistance, but instead judged u for ur desire for justice!


I will not purport to speak for "adjusterjack." However, as it relates to my prior responses, this statement is pure ignorant nonsense. The original poster raised a legal issue. I responded to his/her questions as best as I could based on my knowledge and experience as an intellectual property litigator. The information I provided was legall accurate in all respects. Indeed, your post does not suggest otherwise. Nor does your post provide any useful information or suggest any knowledge of the relevant law.

You first suggested that the poster "submit a request back to the site moderator, requesting that the slander be removed" but that makes no sense. First of all, a DMCA notice is not "slander." Do you know the definition of "slander" and what distinguishes it from libel? Have you ever heard of or read a DMCA notice? Do you understand what the DMCA is and is intended to do? More importantly, do you understand that DMCA notices that get sent the largest online auction site do not get posted on the cite? Therefore, even if the noticed was libelous, there wouldn't be anything to "remove."

You then suggested that the poster "post a rebutle [sic]." That almost makes sense. The DMCA does provide that the target of a DMCA notice can submit a counter-notice that disputes the noticing party's claim. However, how would you propose that the original poster "post" his/her rebuttal?

Your final suggestion seems to be that the poster initiate a juvenile game of name calling and make a logically unsound argument in order to distract from the real legal issues ("Just claim, he's just one of those angry people who is only brave enuff to validate himself by bullying someone while hiding behind his keyboard. If he was a real tough guy (or smarter for that reason), he'd pursue the corporation for making such capable equipment."). First of all, you don't know that the lawyer's client isn't taking action against the manufacturer of the item. Second, even if the client is not doing so, it is patently silly to suggest that the claim made in the DMCA notice is meritless as a result.

Your intent clearly was to help the original poster, but the poster's interests are not well-served with illogical advice that is not informed by a knowledge of the relevant law.




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